2. Casting Directors, Donuts, Euro Stepping & Rude Boize // The Rollers Diaries, Vol. 2

 

Jon grills Isaiah about casting directors and what they actually do for an independent film. We also cover Jon's trip to the Big Apple, Isaiah's near-death experience with an LA cab, their mutual love of donuts and Drake's new album, "Scorpion."

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SHOW NOTES

Great World Cup Dives (Feat. Neymar of Brazil)

A list of the best LA Donut Shops

Don’t Think Twice

Lady Bird

  • Dir. Greta Gerwig
  • Casting Dir. Heidi Giffiths, Allison Jones, Jordan Thaler
  • Watch the Trailer

Did Stanley Kubrick try to break up Tom Cruise and Nicole Kidman's Marriage?

PETA Abuse Hotline

Charlie Smallman, the new producer of I Guess We’ll Do It That Way and Olive, the runner up. Charlie is the bigger one

Drake’s New Album, Scorpion

Drake’s Rant to the haters Which some people say is complete a joke. Who knows.

Euro Stepping Explained (Finally)

Lance Stephenson, “A garbage pail kid”

Follow Nate Drexler on Twitter // @NateDrex

Population of Iceland: 334,000 Official Rules about World Cup Nationality

 

Credits and Personal Links:

A Mama Bear Studios Production // Mama Bear Studios Website

Produced and Edited by: Isaiah Smallman

Executive Producer: Jon Schimpf

Opening music: "The Get Down," Produced by Summer Dregs

Outro music: Composed and Recorded by Tom Paulus and Max Belz

Cover Art by: Nate Giordano

 

Jon Twitter

Isaiah Instagram

Isaiah IMDB

Isaiah’s Twitter (which he never uses)

Isaiah LinkedIn

 

 

 

 

 

TRANSCRIPT (Probably a mess)

 

so I have to pay is this a a small man you're listening to I guess we'll do it that way podcast right call my buddy John each week to check in on my progress as a direct my first feature film Senate by mama bear studios mama there's mission is to create entertaining works of art that explore he made it alright hears of the so to Hey Johnny mayor living it up in the city my man here in New York are you I am indeed the city that never sleeps the Big Apple the big easy those are not the same places very very different places vague the New York is the least easy place I've ever heard of in my entire life people are meeting New York I mean I love I love New York but they're they're mean they're mean to you of old because they smell my fear they see your weekend they're trying to weed you out of me food that is it is there yeah yeah a works works like a charm how do people respond to you I'm toting around little junior so the reception is always great there like I yes more people that we can corrupt from the young age just impressed you know anytime you see a kid doing something difficult like if you were hiking up a mountain and there were a ten year old next you trying his hardest to do it you be impressed and the same sort of thing happens here in old grizzled New Yorker sees a ten and a six year old hoofing it down the street right and he he says feel some mutual respect for that kid and as soon as I must be a good guy that I bred them to be this way but whatever I wasn't really know is that they're just walking because of the threat of spanks O. so they're terrified I had a I had a real New York moment the other day actually I was crossing the street because I kind of live in the city I mean I I live in the city it's right city it's the city and I was walking to get it done not with my uncle who is visiting %HESITATION LA is big downtown unlike New York that's one major bonus every New York there's not a Dunkin donuts in sight it's all local places that mostly also sell Lotto tickets and %HESITATION you know Chinese food or burgers but their donuts are good these are help homemade doughnuts very delicious homemade donuts I mean kind of in the classic style of a Dunkin donuts they're not like their fancy done it's too button for the most part that the other they're pretty basic pretty basic style raised fried doughnuts and they are bang in how to the top them %HESITATION any any way you want but I'm kind of a classic I like I like glazed I like %HESITATION glaze twist like Bavarian cream with chocolate %HESITATION yeah I'm pretty to I'm a pretty straight straight down the middle guy as long as the quality of the day I was there do you have any apprehension about eating a doughnut and public zero so you get these donuts also you get six doughnuts twelve donuts you'll walk out of Kelly's donut shop Sally's donut shop and there's a bench outside and people are sitting out there in donuts you'll join them you'll sit out there and you'll eat it down out in front of everybody %HESITATION hundred percent you get some custard on your face a little powdered sugar in your beard you're not afraid I was wondering if your worry I was a I was wondering if the root of that question was more that like some some donuts are sort of phallic in shape this says a lot about your personality in your file your private mental life and I'm still kind of working through some repressed feelings apparently towards donuts mainly no I mean the shame of getting sugar and Greece so I get that and I get that %HESITATION I mean it's kind of a car town so you honestly I take my daughter back to my car and eat in the car yeah is there shame involved here I mean usually the first one I feel fine and then once I've gone I've left got on the interstate turned around and come back for the fourth time to get another Donna that's usually when I start feeling some shame you think any director casting director has ever asked an actor to eat a doughnut in front of them just to see how they eat it down at the role requires you eating a doughnut so safe here and the defenses of that not having happened are the same as the chances that someone hasn't climbed a palm tree naked and take any **** from the top in Los Angeles I've done that so there we go out then I think it's pretty safe to say that someone has asked a someone in casting session to you don't have you ever seen someone eat it down and a casting session I've never now I've ever asked I should though but then again if there's a role involves eating it done and I'm casting myself we're here in town I were you I would pay you to get that role how much would you pay me a dollar fifty better rice with down to three Bucks yeah the price of a fancy Dona yeah I think that seems reasonable so last time we talked we were gonna go real quick I want to tell you I want to tell you my New York moment %HESITATION yet hit me so I was walking down the street to go get it done out right now and a guy in a cab which made it even more of a New York minute because there's not that many cabs in LA again handicap I'm crossing the crosswalk heat big dumb dumb pulls away too far on the interstate intersection any start backing up over me and my dogs he literally almost ran me over and I started banging on his hood and I was like dude what are you doing you don't back up in the middle of a crosswalk that's like number one rule of driving everyone knows that anyway it was a pretty classic New York moment there was a guy walking in there that's kind of how did you resolve that situation I was like get your **** together your professional driver and I walked it was just a yellow cab like a typical taxi cab resident who were left yeah yeah I expect this kind of the S. from a left no it was a yellow cab this guy is like supposed to be a true professional I was ticked I think a lot of people in that situation let the car hit them and sue I think I should have done it I coulda made rollers even bigger could be huge right now I should have made sure that my neck was very very staff you have some acting experience so you could really pull this off that was a major missed opportunity could sell a hand this is a bummer I'm gonna go find another cab we sat down and watched a few minutes of the World Cup which is %HESITATION it's excellent soccer and excellent acting I know I feel like you really can't play at that level as you were terrific actor these guys flop rubbing their muscles screaming five minutes later they're kicking goals and I mean it's unreal well and honestly to these guys are so strong I mean eat it took to play at that level for ninety consecutive minutes your muscles are so resilient they they you know I mean they are not going to get hurt that easily but I I mean Hey like this is a game it's not without it's not outside the rules you got to do everything we possibly can to win to take a break to you know get somebody else Yellowcard whatever it's got to be what's funny is that the refs don't put an end to it yeah they reward this behavior feels like they should have a panel up without score cards to put up the for how well that player and then when the film instead of penalty kicks a precisely acting points yeah I like that %HESITATION cool we should pray reintroduce the show because I'm sure everyone's already forgotten about it %HESITATION this is I guess we'll do it that way a show where I I say a call you Johnny there once a week to talk about the making of rollers among many other things as you probably already know John where did we leave off last week who knows it's been an entire week I think we decided that we were going to end up talking today about casting directors which incidentally has already sort of come up that's very true casting directors oh yeah because this week that was kind of the next big big thing for me wall what's happened this I mean honestly if not much is happening as we are now I think this is gonna be recover occurring theme no it actually some stuff started to come together this morning tele minutes minutes before we start recording no I think this is this is probably a good time to address it though that is going to be a recurring theme of this podcast for sure I think we can change that the theme of the theme of things not happening as quickly as I want them to but you're right maybe we can change it you need to change it maybe this will spur you on ten make more content by causing drama you know yeah tell some actors that they got the job in column back in town they didn't get the job who would see some heartache some drama John you should be a producer I like the way you think it's because I sound like Weinstein now earn a you don't sound rape you to sound smart keep manipulative so yeah so basically the casting director %HESITATION I'm not gonna drop any names because she has not attach yourself yet but got a very positive email back we're going back and forth we're kind of talking about you know the size and scope and type of the project and what my expectations are in the woman I'm talking to a super super cool and %HESITATION yeah I hope she hopes she gets excited about the project wants to do it she read it last week so %HESITATION but she's traveling so we're just kinda emailing at this point we might we might end up on the phone later today so I might actually have a more exciting update next week **** hole but I might have had on a promise everybody how did you even get hooked up with this person in the first place that is good question okay you know I started going through a lot of decent sized in the movies that I've liked from the last X. number of years five six three names three names three names of casting directors now of movies all movies okay one that I really like don't think twice he seen that one might perfectly it's about an improv troupe in New York now it's really really good it's okay so part of the reason that was interesting to me is it's very funny but it's very dramatic it's a little dark %HESITATION that is something that I think homely I'm trying to achieve with rollers and so I looked at that I was like boom that movies freaking great who brought all those people together well I'm assuming maker Biglia had a lot to do with it but at the same time I'm sure the casting director had a lot to do with it %HESITATION another one would be labor from last year GC labor now John we gotta get you in more movies and now if John doesn't even like movies %HESITATION herbal I've heard lady bird is good I've heard of Burr Biglia because he'd this is on NPR all the time who are used to be I don't even know that he was one of the city is a really great comedian %HESITATION you should look up the stuff he's he's amazing I'll link to some of his his definition of it's we know Mike listen so Hey Mike Mikey boy he our to our to listeners we are now up to we've got teddy Bronson of Wisconsin and Mikey bored labor big cleo from right here in New York City yeah baby I think does live in New York I think I heard an interview with him or that you want to go track them down I'm already working on it he's probably busy listening to our podcast so you know it's at home he sleep walking around the city mmhm nice reference I like so he but here's the real question so you have a movie you say okay this is of similar size as to what I'm making and you look at the credits and you find the casting director but you said earlier find a casting director who I like and I think most people out there like how would you know if what they did was good or not don't they aren't they really just going out and saying who can we get in our price range for this type of movie and they're just basically selecting the people who say yes I think that's a good yeah that's a really good question I hate I think it probably really depends on the type of project I think it depends on the casting director themselves and yet the people that I started calling it taints your previous question basically what I did is there's a website called IMDb there's a version of I am to be caught I'm DB pro which you know you pay like a very small annual fee and you just get a little bit more information and so some people will include you know contact information for either their company or themselves or whatever's necessary and so when I when I did create this list identify these people and some of them didn't have any information up so I just had to track it down you know by if say they have a name of their company but not %HESITATION you know not actual phone number or an email I would just kind of do some internet research and and find it and you know call them or email them and just say Hey here's the years just the project here's what I've done before is this the kind of thing you'd be interested in talking about and they say yes or no and yes it's kind of hit or miss from there once they're attached to what I actually do what are they actually doing okay well again it okay so that's where it comes into it depends on the project as a casting director in this case what I'm really excited about is finding someone who is going to have great ideas about people that I haven't thought of like Hey there's this actor that is in this show where there's this actor who's in this movie a couple years ago that you may not know and you should really think about that or what if we went to this person who is a little bigger but like we can maybe find a connection to them or hear someone that no one's ever heard of it all but I saw them in this thing and they are incredible let's have them in and talk to them and see if they'd be a fit for the role I think in my mind that's with perfect casting director does and then beyond that what they did then are able to do is say help me think through will these people work together well like will they have good chemistry you know so it's it's partly like it depends on the role and so with big leads there's a smaller list of people to potentially fill those roles and so with a big big big studio movie for example I think a lot of casting directors are %HESITATION you know there's only a handful of people who can headline a fifty to a hundred million dollar movie %HESITATION within any given age range gender etcetera and so that less is gonna be pre eighty short there's you know there's only so many Tom Hanks out there and so part of their job I I assume I mean I've never made a movie like that is to you know figure out what the deal is with those people figure out whether they're available you know pitch them on the project but you know at this level it is a lot more kind of keeping tabs on who's out there keeping tabs on projects making sure that we're thinking through every possibility and not just kind of you know going with the most obvious choices I think there are the obvious perception of a lot of people it's like the script comes in and the part calls for a two hundred and fifty pounds Samoan ex wrestler whose name has to do with lithography and she says you know who am I gonna get right what are the circumstances under which a casting director could get fired I would fire casting director if I felt like they were kind of phoning it in in saying lets you know if I was like I really want to push this like let's think outside the box is find somebody who looks different you know or find somebody who is it the first person that comes to mind when I think of this role for for example like there's so many movies so many movies get made so many indie movies and this is not to say that this is bad I I this is not a value judgment I just think it it is a in easy thing to slip into where it's just like great let's cast every role with typical white hipster twenty seven year old white hipster male female insert X. number of actors there's a number of people who can do that that's fine I want to see that's what the people want is that we'll see that's the thing though it is a you know a bunch of bearded guys let's just preponderance circle had to eat all of the problems with Hollywood by starting at the Indy level let's only cast white hipsters and then will only end up with white hipster movie stars it's perfect I love that plan John but it really does come down to what the script calls for like years what is that who were the leaves your script okay so there's really three three it's kind of an ensemble movie which is really fun and so again in this case I think a really count the casting director is going to look at it and say you know these are some people that maybe we should really think about and they're not the kind of people you would immediately thought of but man they would look so good day they would feel so good together they would feel like family for example there's a brother and a sister Madeon Rufus %HESITATION those are two of the three kind of main leads and then there's a second tier of really heavily featured supporting actors and so %HESITATION there's a lot of really juicy roles and so my goal there is to say obviously all of those rules don't need to be people that I've heard of I I hope that maybe one or two of them are just so that we can kind of help raise the profile of the project but %HESITATION finding people who played supporting roles in TV shows or or smaller movies and saying like man these people you may not have heard of them but they're gonna look great on screen with these other people and they're just gonna have like really great chemistry and where she finding these people is she going to local theaters I mean what is the actual work of getting is isn't this just a person that knows like fifteen actors now it's more like I if they end up knowing a ton of actors I think the real skill is probably I mean I don't know exactly how they do their job maybe down the road we can talk to somebody and really get into their world but out my assumption is that they'd kind of do it in a similar way that I do which is they watch a ton of stuff and keep notes on people that jump out at them and just sort of keep an idea of like Hey this is the kind of person that would be good for this kind of thing but what I really want help with in a movie like this is there's a brother and a sister for example manifest they need to be very believable as brother and sister obviously because they are brother and sister but how do we do that in a way that again is not just sort of a straight up the middle let's cast to people that kinda look exactly the same like that's not really what sells them as brother and sister you know right it's the chemistry it's it's the chemistry and I'm even kind of interested in thinking about Hey do they even have to look the same can one of them be Asian and one of them be white or one of them be black and one of them is Indian I don't know I mean I'm come clearly open and that's the kind of thing that I think a really excellent casting director is going to be able to help think through in some of this to it depends on the leads like frankly I'm probably not going to be in a position where I'm auditioning a lot of these leaks I'm probably gonna be making straight offers because people like auditioning auditioning sucks and so some of this is gonna be trust is gonna be largely based on their previous work right the people submit like a deck to you or a an audition tape or do you just look at their previous films a bit what if somebody hasn't been anything well the neck is we would audition them right the reason we would not dishing them is because they're just at the level where they don't have to audition anymore right %HESITATION but typically a you're just looking at previous work and then you know the the typical process is they send a real witches I hate reels side note I hate reels there that there are real is basically %HESITATION this is so annoying one is my my I pad keeps being eight the volume is down in its on do not disturb so I don't know how that yeah demonized okay I could hear it just then and I could hear you like pause yeah in it dad makes me angry it's totally fun yeah I think I'm gonna turn my wifi off so **** **** **** being put to impeding his neck in a killer call now I'm on my laptop for the call so what was the question again %HESITATION you were in the middle of telling me that casting directors up we talk about chemistry %HESITATION finding people who are right for the roles %HESITATION flow may find the direct offers right to making direct offers not auditioning people yeah another thing that it occurs to me when you're making an independent movie is cost has got to be a huge consideration right so it part of me is like if you had the capability to do something like it sounds like you have the capability to go out there and find these actors if it really just entails looking at work so you can go watch fifty independent movies and find people for this role is there any temptation to just want to do all a lot of the stuff yourself a lot over a hundred percent absolutely but here's the thing is I'm not again I I believe I believe in I believe and collaboration let's get real cheesy for a minute here now just super cheesy no I believe in collaboration I believe that someone else is gonna have not necessarily better ideas although they'll probably have better ideas but more importantly they're gonna have different ideas right and that's what is going to make this movie get I mean okay that's the name of this podcast which we should talk about at some point I don't know if we've explained yet the name of the podcast is I guess we'll do it that way which is very much at the core of this question which is yeah like if it look if if all these casting directors like do this script sucks and I don't won't take any risks on you because you seem like a real hack then yeah I'm gonna be like okay cool then I guess I'll just are calling all these actors myself like when the actors something about going to I know her agent so what I would do is I'd call her agent I'd say Hey do you think you can get this her and hopefully she would say yes and could I do that absolutely but am I gonna come up with as many good ideas no and more importantly another thing that casting directors do if they've made good stuff is that the legitimized project and so win actor why is thinking about you know when you're trying to get it to them their agent or their manager or whoever is their main gate keeper is to some extent going to be trying to shield them from bullshit and so when a casting director with great credits comes and says Hey I think this project is worth your time that's a completely different situation than some no name director like me calling them and sort of getting stuck at the bottom of the pile that's fastening that actually makes a ton of sense the legitimize the project by attaching themselves to it in that in in in the more people that attach themselves more legitimate the project gets and so the first actor that signs on is often the hardest and then if that person is really cool in the second person like on him work with that person isn't really great and then it just snowballs so these are all the rules are not cast at the same time they might pick of the main lead months or weeks or whatever ahead of all the other parts and use that as leverage to get yes the people they want absolutely but again back to the I guess we'll do it that way thing part of what happens is oh so and so is available on these windows next year March April and July and everything else they're booked and so we're like cool I guess we're gonna try to pull it off in April and then we start going everyone else in one of the first things you do when your check with actors you check their availabilities and you say Hey are they even available in the spring in there like now they're on a TV show until July and so you're like okay cool do we want to do it in July do we want to restructure do and this is why even huge movies you know another thing that we're producing a much much much bigger movie with like actual movie stars he would have heard of that would be a fine one to talk about down the road I can't talk about a time right now but like things here in a stars now right I'm just teasing everybody Kelly my wife was listening to the first episode she's like you better keep all these promises like in the show knows better be good because I need to show notes of like all they're going to be good I'm gonna make sure I got everything in there get ready to be disappointed Kelly yeah exactly Kelly's never no one's ever gonna listen episode three for sure but %HESITATION the idea would be so with even with bigger movies where money is really not the issue because they're paying people buku money to do these big movies shore the real problem is like the only get to do like three movies a year if you're not and then sell in and do you know so and so had to lose fifty pounds to do it and cut his hair off so like he's kind out of commission for the rest of the year and then you know and then this other guys like I'm only doing this and this and you know it's all of a sudden you end up making all these compromises and being like okay cool that's not our first choice but how do we find this other person who is also available to same time who also likes this person and then when you get into I mean thankfully I don't think this is as much of a thing for movies this size but I mean eventually get in a situation where it's like other crazy do you want to put up with that you know or they have history with this other person who's on you know who's who's acting in the movie is that gonna be a problem you know mean famously %HESITATION dis people said that Stanley Kubrick used eyes wide shut to break up Tom Cruise Nicole Kidman's marriage you know they're somewhat that way will way why would he do that for what purpose I don't know I don't even really know much about the legend I just maybe wasn't Nicole Kidman I don't know you never heard that I I think it does that not a common legend I thought that was kind of like a typical because they got divorced after that right you just invented a wild wild theory I love my life as I could get my phone just beep did somebody just sent me that on Twitter did know nobody's ever said that you just made that up I don't know I'm gonna find it it look there will be proof in the show knows who we are going to get a letter from his lawyer from his children I'm telling the state yes and I will have the last thing I want he's my hero you had a wild up to some serious forces here my man I'm just driving box office dollars may be so after the cast is set after everybody's lined up sometimes dude sometimes the cast doesn't get set until like the day before your shooting that scene I'm serious I mean I believe and we're shooting hunter gather there were a couple minor roles that we were looking for in till the last minute so after that after you're ready to shoot does the casting director just go to Jamaica what are they do they stick around and help it really depends I think a lot of cases they move on other projects I mean that's one okay another thought on casting directors hit me part of what makes a casting director slightly more approachable than say a famous actor or a big time super producer casting directors are that their involvement is very front loaded and so it's a little bit less when a producer or director or an actor signs on the project and they are stuck with that thing for years potentially you know because obviously they gotta sit through the development process they've got to make it which is like you know potentially months of work between prep and shooting I mean depends on how long the shoot is for advice shut your that's your year basically obviously rollers is not that big and then you've got %HESITATION you know potentially come back for reshoots and then you got it go to festivals and then you got to do like if it's a bigger movie gotta do like talk shows and podcasts in the press tour and all that kind of sucks all the sudden saying yes to one thing is a nightmare you know and see really got to want to do it it's not just %HESITATION it's not just like yeah pop in for if it's a pop in for four days type thing sometimes you can get pretty huge people %HESITATION but in this case you know it's it's you know like especially these leads it's a little bit of a process it's not gonna be a ton of press one nice thing is I'm shooting in LA so you know that's a big pitch to actors is Hey we're you know we're gonna shoot LA you probably live in LA just or maybe New York but either way it you probably spend a lot of time in LA at the very least and so you can probably sleep in your bed you can get other work done but I'm getting off track the point is the casting directors day %HESITATION they they're typically by the time you're in production they're they're pretty they're pretty pretty much moved on wears a producer isn't done really ever because even after the movie is released are still sending out okay accounting reports and you know %HESITATION finding new territories to sell a film to and all that kind of stuff do you know the path to become a casting director mean that's not something you go to school for right now that's actually good question I'm assuming the path is you start as someone's assistant and did they give you more things to do like I don't know exactly what casting assistant does on a day to day basis but I assume it's something like they are doing some of that research they're answering stuff the coordinating stuff they're doing whatever and then eventually they're like Hey want you you know here's this project that I don't have time for one of you can help me out I got to know we have to research this because now it's like who was the first casting director who never that's a good question come who is the for okay it would've been late actually I bet because back in the day it well but then again okay there's kind of two key components casting there's leads and names and all that kind of half you know there's there are the bigger people and then there's everyone else in the movie which is a completely different process because even a movie like the size of rollers a lot of the roles we are going to be auditioning people for but that's where some of the work of a of a cash record really comes in is because you've got the two halves you've got the the bigger half which is like leads to in this particular case with rollers I'm not necessarily going to be auditioning most of these leads I'm probably gonna end up going straight to some of them and saying based on your previous work I think it be amazing for this will you read this I might even write them a personal note explaining why I think they're great for the role in they decide to do it or not but they're not really an audition process a lot of the other roles though like all the a lot of supporting roles and and and guy number three who's you know I'm walking near that guy you know you can't audition that guy you got to find a guy because home and can be done that you got to get him to eat it down and for exactly I mean you got to see if you can eat a doughnut naturally a few looks like a looks like a crazy person some people look like crazy people in eight on us and you need that it's a litmus test to see a person's true self when they have powdered sugar on their face like can you hang with that if you can you have some real fortitude if not move along body we need somewhere else yet sorry it's nothing personal but we %HESITATION we don't need you it's not gonna work out get the F. out of my office how sad is it that really for the guy guy number three when you don't get that part %HESITATION Cascadia auditioning is brutal I mean I and most really famous people don addition all but I mean do it sucks because he okay let me describe a typical audition okay hit me you walk into the casting director's office there's like literally forty other people standing around they all kind of look like you year number twenty three you go in depending on the size a role and I had the the the distinct honor of being on both sides of of of this of this coin evolution for things and I've auditioned to people you've been dying to sitting there like a Shelob yeah and it's %HESITATION and you know it also sucks being the guy telling guy number twenty two thank you that was great and he walks out and you're like that was never going to happen there jobs were like oh that guy is great he just took in our and a half of his day to get here early and sit in front of me for literally three and a half minutes if that I've done auditions where I was in there for ten seconds not really ten seconds but under a minute because it's like yeah it's literally like you just pop in its for commercial they're like Hey take your shirt off while kind of commercials this %HESITATION I did %HESITATION it's that this special kind of commercial know this particular one okay this is part one of the dumbest auditions ever done is for like a cell phone commercial but the whole thing was a guy in a shower so they're like didn't actually make me take my shirt now they actually they did they want me take my shirt off to see what I look like shirtless which is fine I don't care I wore shorts and then I had to pretend like I was taking a shower I mine to shower described the room to us how many people are in this room in anywhere from one to five maybe it depends on the net is the one that you were in the one that you were in where you belong casting director one guy casting director making tape what city was this an easy walk in and you're like this is my name you know whatever %HESITATION this is in LA you walk in you like this is my name and and %HESITATION you know he said in the camera and then basically they're just making a big Ole list of people and so on the other side what do that the next step is I get let's say it's a commercial or movie for that matter %HESITATION I get in some form usually over the internet a %HESITATION you know a a list of or up a bunch of links to either a single link with a whole bunch of people with names and all that kind of stuff or like a link their little audition and %HESITATION and the resume and maybe an acting real %HESITATION I was saying earlier I hate reels here's why he reels and acting real is basically when you cut together a bunch of partial scenes and make like a little sizzle reel that shows how good of an actor your charm is there just never good there never good because the the things you were doing were never meant to be viewed in that way so it's you whipping around saying Hey I'm walking here and they take that put a yeah you like Hey I'm walking in the next thing you know you're in a different costume in a different place doing a different scene I just always would prefer to see I guess here's the thing a real can tell me if someone's bad I can tell someone's bad just by looking at a real I shouldn't really tell if they're good by looking at a real so then you bring him in so then I bring him in if I like my bring him in and I'm like Hey you know what's up dude don king if you're just starting out the next step would be let's say I have like a hundred a hundred people I mean it to be a totally depends but let's say a hundred people you know I would usually give some direction to the cash director maybe its sides if if it's a movie you know its price at the line you know the side space sides is basically the the peace of the scene or the peace the script that's relevant to that particular actor fanatical role and so the you know they may have the sides ahead of time and that's a whole nother thing how they get those sides that's usually %HESITATION it really depends on the size and role but usually these people out agents those those people's agents get contacted by the casting director by other people and and say to their actors who they represent their like Hey you you you you should come in here's a side to be ready you know have this monologue memorized have this other thing or have this line you know I'm locking him make she said you know three different ways and so you go in and you'll say it three different ways and then you walk out you're gonna get alone so this podcast I think you think I'll get a head like that role that's not you can be on NYPD Blue fifty times if I could get a job being that guy fifty times on NYPD Blue I would make good money yeah and probably be able to not have another job and make movies Hey if you're listening NYPD Blue casting rector I'm gay some of the ways that solid gold thank you John so what happens is I look at this beagle list of people and I'm like wow you know %HESITATION thirty percent of these people can't act unfortunately and %HESITATION choose your worst relief scene so I don't even know how to start hit me I mean I don't even know how to describe you know when you're like watching someone who can't act it's the worst %HESITATION it's just so painful it is absolutely excruciating homemade real if you're just starting out you you gotta put in what you're selling some in high school sometimes I I'm even I mean well that's the thing is it's really hard to get started because well how do you get rolls of you have been in anything and how do you get anything if you haven't gotten rolls right is it's a cleaner to classic chicken or the egg tell the kids out there right now I am have to tell the kids out there right now how do you get a how do you get a role kids out there right now I don't know I actually don't know I mean it's a it's a it's a haul it's you gotta find people you know that are making stuff and you got to get them to put you in it that's really what has to be and and I will say I don't usually judge acting based on the quality of the production value I can definitely see a little bit of a like okay this short is but Roche yes but that's not the actors fall in that in some cases are all bad should you know what you gotta do you gotta try some I've made terrible stuff that's just the way it goes that everybody makes bad stuff that's just how that's how you get better some you at right now exit we our making just a god awful podcasts of that later we can make a good podcast and but it won't real quick back to process though easy you know I don't even usually I don't look at a lot of reels unless I feel like I need a little bit more info typically let's say we have all these tapes and it's the person saying their lines or in some cases you know you come up with other ways to sort of see if they can do it like the donut thing that's a great Johnny should be cast record because that's maybe not the donut but it's a good idea for example there's one rollers the donut guy now casting director I'm available %HESITATION who the guy in my telling about casting directing is gonna be my casting director I love that I'll text you my fear right now okay is it above or below a million dollars I'm insulted that you'd even ask me that question if right will lower business I like your style it's all donuts I have a huge expenditure I'm gonna write a donut guy into the movie and you're gonna be the donut guy John I'm committing to that on the record right now I will fly out I will do this I love it okay so let's say it's a small role sometimes you got to come up with kind of creative ways to see if someone can do it for you handles yeah exactly and and and I've had roles where there's not a lot of talking but there's a lot of acting shore and some of its kind of improv some like you know sometimes you come up with this is I'm not saying this is good I'm just saying it actually kind of worked in this situation %HESITATION there is a person and the script it this was like a really last minute commercial the script was still in flux I was like I'm not gonna you know I'm not gonna try to make these people like memorize all this stuff and you know be this character and whatever so let's just honestly these people if they're right for the role part of it's going to look that's one thing I'm I I would say to young you know young actors the the the unpleasant reality is look look sexier no it's not that all the problem is each job because sometimes you just look the part or you don't and I think that's kind of an unfortunate reality like if they have somebody with brown hair and you know kind of shortened a little stubby and your lanky and tall Hey shoot going there do your best maybe they'll change their minds but the reality is a lot of the time they're just going like yeah they just don't look the part fix your body you got about a surge or just do you know you just may not get every part I think Jim pal that's my wet body it get it least three inches cut out of your legs put down at down put that down at down there is exactly the kind of message that will be spreading John there's a guy going around to give all of our listeners body image problems sorry keep on there's a guy walking around New York on quote unquote auditioning for as many rules as he can eating all the freemen's so the last thing I'll say about casting is you know they they there's an example where it's like Hey you know I don't need you to say all the I don't need you to do this like amazing Shakespeare monologue I just need to know that you're comfortable on camera and so you just come up with like a thing that they can do that will show you if they're comfortable on camera or if they can think on their feet or you just have to kind of decide what the role requires and then you have to figure out how to test those people it's almost like %HESITATION it's almost like science you know you have a hypothesis and then you've got to decide does does this work you know you're like I think dogs have emotions and then you have to come up with a test to actually figure out and create some sort of tangible evidence as to whether or not dogs have emotions in casting can be a little bit like that like I think you look right now can you do this can you be this way can I see you as small or can I see you as pathetic or can I see you as giant or strong or angry and that's really what it comes down to its last like I mean some of its professionalism some of its you know just can you be flexible can you think on your feet but some of its can I believe that you are a certain person or certain way how do you test to see if the dog has emotions I don't know that's a good question speaking of which we've got some new applications for producers my my sweet little kiddies with my niece right now %HESITATION Kitty cat came back well I'm not taken aback she can live with you but she's not a producer anymore I'm sorry I can't says bush league as soon as she saw my my niece who immediately picked this beautiful little Kitty happen started cuddling her and feeding her and taking care of her she was completely down with me the cat wants nothing to do with me anymore I think we're through well how should have a better life yeah I think that's great I think that she had it coming she did do a good job producing our last episode guides the first one was she produced like the first three minutes of it she said the Mike up and then that was it what do you think about have you met my dogs all of them Charlie because they're both vying for the role real hard I'm completely in favor of that that's not too nepotistic for you I mean if they fill out a form I watch a video you know go through the process is totally fine will speaking of casting I was trying to think of how to test whether or not they kind of have the %HESITATION the roll with the punches added to that a producer would need for show for a you know a high stakes show like this you have to do that well I I don't know yet I'm still working on kind of vetting them but earlier I decided to sort of get on the floor kinda wrestle with them a little bit and I found a toy that they really liked and I made them fight to the death I'm gonna put the phone number to pizza and the show now it's no I it's it's day trust me no one got hurt I stop them but I just needed to know that they if I say fight to the death with your brother all of I want you to kill him this is an Abraham and Isaac situation yeah exactly I needed to know that she would do it and she was totally in just your recitation and I I had to stop or she had her her mouth around Charlie's jugular and she was about to rip it out and I was like all of you got you got it but then it soon Charlie didn't waste a second he as soon as I said you're done he he took advantage of of her guard being down and he got her hand and so now they're tied and I can't decide which one we should give their all too after all that work it's gonna be a shame but just flip a coin alright let's %HESITATION let's flip okay I got a quarter I'm gonna flip now call in here okay as for all of Charlie got it it was tales he wanted it more yeah he definitely wanted it more okay says a %HESITATION you told me to listen to that Drake the new album scorpion what do you think of it I started at this morning listen the first two songs but I pulled it up on my phone on I tunes you know and they have notes about the album and Drake wrote the editor notes show for you for instance you know if it were like kids he goes it would say kid cutting Kanye west made this album last year blah blah blah it's a little bit about it but Drake wrote the editor notes for his album and they are the following your reading yes I'm so ready okay this is all caps so the person is screaming this I person being Drake yeah Drake is it cool to like Drake by the way I don't even know I just send it to you because like all this is blown up who's gonna read like three of these amps can relate okay ready yet and we can answer that question after we read this is it okay electric or is it cool electric is a cool okay ahead okay I hate when Drake raps Drake sings too much Drake is a pop artist who drink doesn't even write his own songs Jake didn't start from the bottom Drake is finished Jake thinks he's Jamaican what what Jake is an actor Drake changed anybody else later than sign Drake that's what he wrote I am dying right now it's crazy right so I saw that I had to read it like four times what does this mean Drake is going through some **** sick of the haters **** with them that is wild intense but the songs they sounding the haters are **** with them with good reason do you have an opinion on that no I mean I don't either I don't know anything about any of these people I know very little about him at all you make great songs do that's where it stops like I don't care what you do after that does he make great songs though yeah yeah he's okay I mean who I mean I think it is easy fresh out to the beach always sound so why I know I mean what it means not Williamsburg right now yeah yeah and I just said y'all y'all baby southerner but I did listen to one of the songs and Drake said that he zero stepping somewhere like his euro step in past people into the metaphorical and zone of success I guess some I just makes so many metaphors but not do you know I could not get that image out of my mind of Drake traveling because that's what is your your stepping is traveling right I bet it's a very luxurious process you know what you're stepping as you know I'm talking about I don't know I don't know how we know so little about basketball we're gonna be exposed here okay so yeah so you're a step is when you take like one two three I think people are screaming right now with the radios were on the radio teddy screaming because of how stupid I am right now but I think it's one two three steps shoot the ball get points owe you get twenty suits brought it over with basketball you know you make the basket you get points yeah yeah but these guys brought this like step over from Europe which is why it's from Europe league basketball and brought it over to the NBA hero stepping and now it's kinda G. year established and get away with it yeah daughter step it's a very it's a unique sort of thing but it looks like straight up traveling OC you meant travelling like traveling in basketball not traveling in Europe exactly I was picturing Drake on a jet that was the wrong image we gotta get a Canadian the horn did yeah we got a buddy need Drexler sports expert maybe you can clear pure stepping for us we think he's a sports writer he knows a lot of stuff about sports let's see what he has to say about your stepping we're just sports in general of baby is a level of those exports Nate oooh baby we got matrix or on the horn on biological I stay at my west coast spread my only west coast connect how are you neat I'm so good can you hear my boy Johnny bear Hey Anthony what's going on shot a bear what's going on with my man I'm just a few blocks away in beautiful Astoria I was gonna say long time no talk welcome to the east coast my friend Anthony never panned a nice screen last night together always scared we went on an ice cream journey and Johnny bear as yourself actually called him got ice cream snickers bar for the walk he was delicious like an appetite for the ice cream that we bought we bought ice cream and he got an ice cream bar and appetizers man after my own heart that is it was delicious I've got no regrets no regrets that is exactly how I would have done as right after we had to Blackie celebrities take their eyes power that seems like the kind of thing Drake would do who know we gotta get uncle Nate we gotta get I'm going to clear the suffers uncle Nate what is a year a step it's really hard to explain we found that to be true selves own thank you but essentially we connection at all to the basket at and you're holding the ball and you do something of a crossover step shoot shoot the defender and a leading one direction but it's really an awkward move so like it's sort of like the opposite of like a jab step to get a guy because when your jab stepping you're usually just going like comments about your body is going whichever way your jabbing but when he stepped you're actually jabbing opposite of the moment some of your body so it like EE confuses the defender and then you and then also uses his off balance enough that you can you can go up but it requires an incredible amount of coordination and worked out a lot of guys just can't Polack it's it's it's it's very tricky I don't really it's hard to explain exactly what it is you have to you too but I need tells real quick what you think about lebron James going to LA well I had a horrible night last night I mean I really I lock closure I have people of my Twitter telling me it's going to be okay and not to lose your cool lebron %HESITATION signed a four year contract with the Los Angeles Lakers and it's not about the fact that he signed a contract with a different team I'm not a cafe animal the brown family follow up anywhere I only he Jersey and a cat Jersey with his name on it LA is a huge market whatever it's gonna be great for his family the problem is they did not immediately build anything around him that's good brought on lance even stand who is like a garbage pail kid of a psycho who the little carbon dioxide in the bronze here in the middle of a very important game several years ago he's like a board and lebron wound me he blew it can you please tell what is blowing carbon dioxide in his ear is that a euphemism carbon dioxide is what is what actually comes out your mouth when you exhale okay she leaned over in the middle of a huge game they were coming out of a time not a playoff game where lebron's playoff life was in jeopardy inexplicably one of those games and lance Stephenson was guarding him in doing a decent job of guarding him in that game and coming out of a timeout he leaned over and blew it is here like softly and tenderly blew air into his years and then it's like you get is a great video and yes love it I love Ron just days staring like you didn't let but like this dude is like the ultimate lebron troll all through his career and gives them headaches media we'd look Ron sizeable Lakers they go get this guy and I think it's because we're brought was like I don't want to have to deal with this guy on the opposite side of the court as me he's not good and he's not going to help this team and he's a garbage pail easy garbage and also the other thing that he does he does this quite often I cannot get past is blowing in the air thing he doesn't say anything he doesn't he bends over and just like you know how like in knowing it would be if like someone gave you like a wet Willie who I would smack in the worse I would literally punch him in the face real that's what everyone wanted to do was punch minutes space will probably just stayed with us great you because he's a pro professional like I want to actually kill this guy he's he's a professional is the best professional what did lebron due to him he must have done something is he just the best kill them you just kill them it's just that he's the best and and lance Stephenson is one of these guys like everyone in the NBA has an ego I don't mean this in a negative way but all these guys if you think about it were the best in their grade school they were the best in their high school they were the best on their college team they were the best on their AAU team so when they get to the NBA it doesn't really register them I'm not as good as lebron James these guys absolutely believes they are the best movies haven't gotten their teens yet yeah yeah exactly like everyone's like I used to work for ESPN a little bit like bike blogging and I covered a lot of games down in Orlando when I was there I talked to a lot of players and I talk a lot better sheer and I think it's a time it was something like white Howard was was maybe gonna sign with a team with another big center and I was like does that scare you you know what that does that worry you to have those two guys in the same and the answer was unanimous and it wasn't like just the sound by these guys like what no like nothing scares me like I can play with anyone like this I mean the best and they really do think that so that's the way that people aren't you must have to think that yeah I mean otherwise you're not you can't get to that level yeah you know we don't think about because we really as fans we see more objectively were like yeah of course lebron is way better than expired of course this guy's better just buyers those guys in that moment they've never been told or believe anything except I'm actually Bob ask if not one or one of the best if not the best players work so there's that mentality still like when they go up so it's not that we're going to have to do anything to have missed that late Stevenson is looking at the mere at night when he goes on to his million dollar condo in Indianapolis and he's like dude I could stop this guy and he has a game where like you actually maybe has twenty points and maybe get the steel off lebron and he's like that just like reaffirms that you know what I'm saying me he lives in Indianapolis wise you live in Indianapolis lightly played for the Pacers arm the Pacers yeah are there soccer team they're they're not they're they're basket during the World Cup right the Senate in the World Cup states don't have teams that go to the world okay contact contact fun fact I sling Iceland in nearly beat Argentina in the World Cup do you know how many people live in Iceland three hundred thousand and they feel that if they feel that a world class soccer team that almost be Lino messy the entire United States did not field a world class soccer team that could almost be messy but I slammed it there are more people living in like Glendale California than there are in the entire country of Iceland and they feel that a world class soccer team how is that possible I don't know but I was going to ask you because I don't so I don't follow the World Cup closely but I'm curious if you look that up another thing you should look up is how many guys on that roster live in Iceland like I'm curious I'm genuinely curious going back to their home country okay that's fine but they're still Icelandic how much do they have to be I don't know but he just like a quarter and still choose to go play price I don't know that could still be true but if we can hide the ethnically connected to a country to play for the team you don't have to be right like the Olympics I external Chinese figure skaters the place that compete for America okay then fine if you can extrapolate out a certain amount of nationality that would be even more true with America right where is our World Cup team yet dum dum the more money you that's like Akron Ohio fielding an NBA team that beats the cavs in the finals not exactly how how I don't know the World Cup is confounding to me like I like I I sort of I sort of just like where we are now because like when did that game happened it wasn't in one of the early rounds where it's just like points that that you have to accumulate yeah I know I don't even know that much no this was this was a points game this was a points game what you're probably out now yeah I'm barely even paying attention I just thought it was a fun fact I see I don't know because in those points games I feel like people are let off the gas a little bit because they're like calculating we don't need to go balls out for this game because all we need is action on to the next round but then I don't like the idea of elimination games either because it's like the NC double a tournament and anyone can beat anyone like you can get a fluke goal I don't I didn't see the game I don't know if I slammed scored loopholes I don't STT messy place for Argentina right he's been getting a lot of slack right for being like kind of a fraud or not playing well you never plan that will help them yeah so I mean I don't know like I feel like an elimination like either World Cup games are just like unpredictable and I don't like killing March madness I yeah I'm more of a series guy I might let these things play against each other three to seven times then we actually knows better and of course I think like I don't know because I actually don't know but I assuming Argentina would probably win in a five game series Overijssel neat let's get a quick hot take on are you coming to Los Angeles to see lebron play or not well I fired off a treat this morning I'm extremely disgruntled about the move people are telling me that he's taken the long con he's building for next year and the year after that I think I live in New York City and I can't afford to go to our next game and the next part arable but I can't afford to get in the stadium eyes I'd love to be scary I think I would love to come to staples center and see what Ron and I follow him anywhere and I tweeted this morning that even though I'm disgruntled I'm I'm all and I'm on board the Lakers fan you know don't ask me don't ask me because I've gone on record to say that I'm a lebron fan so I follow him everywhere not just a band wagon or a life long you choose in a long time ago two thousand two thousand and one I think so have you covered up your cast had to yet I just got a King James that do but check this out I was the I saw online yesterday that a season ticket %HESITATION season ticket prices jumped already %HESITATION for staples that are like fifteen hundred dollars like my gosh %HESITATION so I mean there's just no way I just there's no way I could afford to go insane that so much money so if someone buys me a ticket I will absolutely be there if I can somehow figure out a way to finance the ticket I may do it I would love to see what Ron play at staples center maybe not this year because the team is garbage but maybe like in two years I'm done with long wall of stealing good yes on the four year contract he's great got his championship squad I save up a little bit of money and I get to go to that's all from me for now I hung up on %HESITATION he's there to get in the weeds in this isn't really a sports podcast you now you just hung up on him Coulter I just I I felt like he was gonna take like another ten minutes to wrap up the conversation it was so much sports my head was starting to her I know that's why I had to I just had to get out of there you know so much about sports it's intimidating and my crazy I really was a little worried that we were gonna end up taking another hour to finish that conversation was I was trying to soak in as much of that as I could I love that guy I will come back we'll come back hopefully it'll pick up next time I don't know man that was pretty rude we'll see if I had a ISIS okay speaking of lebron moving speaking of you know Drake and they they I mean that monologue is incredible %HESITATION or whatever you call that act it's in I think it's a message to the haters that's what that that is yeah it's pre it's it's don't you think you have a little for what is he afraid of though is you're freed of his recent success I mean I I because I was I was looking at the lyrics for that previously %HESITATION short it seems like he's terrified of success or what success entails being in the spotlight yeah people hating him people being haters so he's got to respond to them I don't know I guess I can can you have to respond to that I mean that just seems that's a very good question I don't know I really don't know drink your drink you have a jet to yeah acts you don't have to respond to people who call you stupid right now or say you're a bad rapper yeah it seems so but it seems like the entire album is about that at least from what I can tell us into enough of it I just heard those sweet sweet beats and I was seduced the other thing about this drink the drink liner notes is that it sounds a lot like what Kanye west said about himself I like the old kind yeah you know he he referred to the criticism before other people could get changed and somehow his musical style had changed her he's pre responding to the haters quote unquote and tracking who has already been accused of copying people seem like copy Tonya west at this yeah I don't know what that yeah I way we will have to have a a rap will have an address on on we'll get great I can get Draco column Jersey if you're listening had us up I don't know I am I can relate to the sense of of being afraid of the possibility of being seduced by success and and sort of becoming addicted to affirmation now right that there's something about obscurity I I there's part of me that like I do if I'm honest I would love to make movies that everyone watches and and become famous you know vinous I I want that and I'm sure you you know anyone can relate to that I want that for you well thank you John and but there's also a part of me that thinks I'm probably better off being a little bit of a career failure and being stable as a human being you know and I will and I hope I can have both of those things but it scares the crap out of me trying to have both the idea of trying to have both I don't know maybe I'm overreacting maybe I'm putting the cart way before the donkey you know I think we'll just have to explore that I think we will maybe we'll talk about that next week next week we'll check in in here what's with the what has happened since we last yeah I hope we'll have some more progress for you I think you need to create some drama to have something to talk about yeah I think it's time to start poking the bear if you know what I mean fire this casting director get a new one check it out did this casting director gave me the quickest read I've a sheet she read my script in under a week that is miraculous no one ever does that I'm very thankful even if she says no at this point she did not waste my time and I appreciate that you got to get this girl to let you use your name so we can give her a shout out I saw so many nice things about her I know she seems great I mean we'll see if she wants to do the project she doesn't a complete understand sometimes you just can't do everything sure %HESITATION great wall John this is this is been a real pleasure I'm super excited about about next week I hope of some good updates and I hope you have a great time quick tell everybody what you're doing in New York what's in New York are you there I'm here for the Nathan's hot dog eating contest on enter your former champion drinking gallons of water dipping hot dogs in that water and eating it I'm here for a visit to see shows and soak up the culture you know I live in the south now so you get it's like it's like fifty you know I get them clear my system out I got it yeah talks by coming up to the north and although you know Manhattan in particular is like a gated community for rich people now it's so obnoxious there's no counter culture going on it's Disney land for rich people it's like %HESITATION when you go to Harry potter world and everything looks like it's made of stone but it's actually made of its owner of daily bar it sounds like I got stuck on it's a fun place to beautiful place you can go to parks if you have kids it's great you can you know there's tons of free stuff to do everybody's friendly for the most part everything safe in Manhattan but it just it feels like Disneyland and then you come out to like a story %HESITATION which is tons of Greeks tons of real restaurants people trying to sue scrape out a living %HESITATION and it's just it has a completely different feel it's really a story is great I love it excellent alright well I hope you have a great time and %HESITATION will catch up and we talked about it thanks for tuning in for episode two of I guess we'll do it that way today shows produced and edited by say a small entry music was composed by Carl Cadwell and recorded by the distribution outro music by Tom policy in Mexico our cover art was designed by an eight year Donna this is been a production of their studio just can it's your whole